Information from WYSH Radio
Some postal customers in Oak Ridge have recently received letters from the U.S. Postal Service telling them that they need to install curbside mailboxes as part of the ongoing effort to help the federal agency stop hemorrhaging money.
The letters are being sent to postal customers who still use house boxes to receive their mail. The letter states that the request is being made because “letter carriers can service more mailboxes in their vehicles than they can by walking door-to-door.â€Â The letter states that customers have 10 days from receiving it to switch to the curbside mailbox before “mail received at the box will be returned to sender†as if no mail receptacle existed.
Postal officials say that converting deliveries for a more cost-effective outcome is part of an overall effort to save money and streamline operations that also includes implementing recycling programs and energy and water conservation efforts at postal facilities. The letter states that this policy change “supersedes any policy placed into effect by any previous postmaster,†adding that customer age, length of time at a residence, or ease in providing service does not determine how service is provided to the community.
Information in this story brought to you through an agreement between Oak Ridge Today and WYSH. See more local news headlines on the WYSH website at http://www.wyshradio.com/local_news.html.
Katie Isabella says
Hope you are right. I cant install one and my chain link fence is in the way. 🙁
Ck Kelsey says
About time. The Oak Ridge area was the most difficult to deliver .I did it for 5 years and a very high% of Oak Ridger’s Mailboxes an that are not curbside do not adhere to the requirements for delivery. They are supposed to be facing the street and are supposed to be accesible to the letter carrier without obstruction. Glad this issue is finally being addressed. No pun intended.
johnhuotari says
Note: I have removed several comments from this article because the commenters did not use a real, full name. The comments themselves haven’t been a problem, but we do require those who comment here to use their real names (see the comment policy above). Thank you for your understanding and for reading Oak Ridge Today.
Jay says
I will look at this more as a suggestion than more of a “have to”. I have a mail box,the postal service is required to deliver my mail as usual and cannot interfere with delivery.
Roger Galliett says
Usually you aren’t required to change the location of your box once delivery has been in place for 30 days.
Jason Allison says
I will look at this as more of a suggestion than a “must do”. I have a mail box, the postal service is required to deliver my mail and cannot interfere with delivery.
Jason Allison says
I installed a curbside mailbox because a previous letter carrier said she didn’t have to deliver because she saw a dog tie out. My dog was hardly ever tied to it. Now we have an outstanding carrier and he never complains about anything.
Daniel Powers says
I haven’t got a letter yet, but kinda expect to after reading this. However I don’t have post hole diggers that will dig into the asphalt sidewalk. 😀
Harold L. Parkey says
Challenge them by quoting their own rules. The POM 631.6 does not allow them to change your service in most circumstances unless you agree to it in writing.
Ellen Smith says
Apparently this directive doesn’t apply on the side of the street that has sidewalks.
Daniel Powers says
well that is pretty good. I didn’t get a letter but I wanted to joke about digging a post hole in the sidewalk.
Harold L. Parkey says
The USPS cannot force you to change your mode of delivery. Their own regulations the Postal Operations Manual (POM) say the following:
“631.6 Conversion of Mode of Delivery
Inthis section, conversion refers to changing existing mail delivery to a more economical and efficient mode. The key to converting existing deliveries is 631.7 Postal Operations Manual identifying those deliveries that are most costly to the Postal Service. Delivery managers can go into any delivery territory where delivery has been established for over 1 year and solicit to convert the mode of delivery if it would be cost beneficial to the Postal Service. Postmasters should not establish a mixed delivery area where the carrier must zigzag from the door to the curb when previously the carrier took obvious shortcuts to effect delivery. Postmasters must weigh the advantages and disadvantages of converting less than 100 percent of the deliveries. Customer
signatures must be obtained prior to any conversion. In singlefamily
housing areas (including manufactured housing and mobile homes) where the residences and lots are owned, each owner must agree to the
conversion in writing. Owners who do not agree must be allowed to retain
their current mode of delivery.
When a residence is sold, the mode of delivery cannot be arbitrarily changed prior to the new resident moving in. The existing mode of delivery must be retained. If an owners’ association represents the community, it can direct the mode of delivery for the community. In rental areas, such as apartment complexes and mobile home parks, the owner or manager can approve the conversion.”
As it says they can solicit, that is ask, if you want to change. Don’t let them lie to you or try to bully you into changing if you don’t want to.
Ck Kelsey says
They can and should require customers to adhere to basic delivery rules. Mailbox is to be on the side of the house facing the addressed street. Oak Ridge is 40 years behind on that alone.
Ck Kelsey says
And they can go to “Cluster boxes” without a signature from any residents.
Harold L. Parkey says
No, they can’t. Read the POM. It says they can “solicit”. It’s just a scheme the Managers and Postmasters use to trick the unknowing public into improperly changing their mode of service.
Ck Kelsey says
The can and should go to central delivery boxes . Because it’s better for the letter carriers ,and the Postal Service is very labor intensive. carriers have the worst job of all government employees.On outer drive the route I had ,after I left a Carrier was hit getting mail out of his LLV and lost a leg. That was something I was able to avoid ,it’s a dangerous job with very little thanks other than the good pay and benefits.
Jason Allison says
Again, you are quoting an obsolete POM. This isn’t a conspiracy, they’re not trying tro get over. I live in a house which the main entrance faces my back yard. Even the city workers have issues at times. This is an effort to speed the delivery, not keep people’s mail hostage.
guest says
Not obsolete, read current legislation in the house and senate, they are still trying to get this changed because as of right now it’s illegal. They have been trying this in different areas nationwide with little success. I got the same letter 2 years ago and still have a box on my house and still get my mail delivered every day. If they send anyone’s mail back they should sue. Just another attempt to get rid of jobs. USPS not bleeding money like they claim.
Jason Allison says
Yes…and I will say I stand corrected. Nothing wrong with being well informed.
Harold L. Parkey says
The Postal Operation Manual I quote from is the July 2002 issue. It’s available in a searchable format on many websites. I cannot find any changes to the language that has been published in the Postal Bulletins. If you have a more current issue with different language please let us know. I believe the letters are purposely sent out by some managers and postmasters in an attempt to misinform or intimidate the customers into changing their service. I would not trust them to tell you the truth.
Jason Allison says
If you re-read the article it is stated that this change supersedes any policy placed into effect by any previous postmaster.
Harold L. Parkey says
The main point being-as the POM states, “In single
family housing areas (including manufactured housing and mobile homes) where the residences and lots are owned, each owner must agree to the conversion in
writing. Owners who do not agree must be allowed to retain their current mode of delivery.†I’m familiar with the tactics postal management uses with their customers and employees. Many postal managers are not to be trusted. For the most part the employees get the job done in spite of their bosses, not because of them.
Jason Allison says
This is not a point of the post office wanting to get over on people or strong arming its a point that some resident’s box location is more on the ridiculous distance from the road. As any government body, when policies change that change is made and it negates any previous rules. The POM in which you are quoting is now old and obsolete.
Ck Kelsey says
That’s correct Jason and there are NO Mobile Homes in Oak Ridge BTW Harold.
Ellen Smith says
An article in one of the local print newspapers reports that Oak Ridge city manager Mark Watson has asked the postal service to delay (and reconsider) this requirement. His concerns included the inadequate advance notice provided to customers and the expectation that the addition of curbside mailboxes would eliminate a lot of on-street parking spaces (because people shouldn’t park vehicles where they would block access to mailboxes).
Ck Kelsey says
Ellen ,Oak Ridge is unique when it comes to mail delivery ,that’s for sure.
Ellen Smith says
I don’t think Oak Ridge is unique in the way mail is delivered, but I do know that Oak Ridgers who get mail delivered to their doors have told me it’s a special thing they value about their homes and their neighborhoods.
My family always had mail delivery to our door (actually, it was through a slot in the front door) in the houses I lived in while growing up, as well as in most of the places I lived as an adult before moving to Oak Ridge.
It’s been a long time since the postal service stopped doing that sort of thing for newly built houses, but that’s how mail delivery used to be done (and still is done, mostly) where there are sidewalks and the houses were fairly close together. Mail carriers I’ve talked with (apparently not including CK Kelsey) have told me that in that kind of layout, it’s more efficient for a carrier to walk from house to house than to drive from mailbox to mailbox. Carriers on walking routes have also told me that they appreciate the exercise and the personal relationships they can have with their customers (but the relationships with certain dogs are a downside).
I can understand why the postal service would want people to change over to new configurations — like cluster mailboxes on the corner of each block. However, it’s unrealistic to expect that neighborhoods that were built 70 years and set up for an entirely different form of mail delivery can change over easily — and particularly not with just 10 days notice. Where I live, we have mailboxes by the street, but if I lived in a house with mail delivery at the door and got one of those letters, I imagine we’d have a hard time figuring out how to comply with the new rules.
Ck Kelsey says
Oak Ridge is totally unique because of the older homes that do not face the street that they have their address on. All you would have to do is work one day on the walking routes as a PTF (Former designation for Part Time Flex) carrier and you would change to a more informed view. The other reason it’s unique is because of the number of cul-de-sac’s between Tn. ave. and Outer Drive. All walking routes.These would be better served with a cluster box in each one and the parking would not be affected at all. Please don’t take my word for it Ellen . Find out for yourself and the truth will become evident within one hour of your feet on the ground in an actual mail delivery scenario.
Ck Kelsey says
Oak Ridge is totally unique because of the older homes that do not face the street that they have their address on. All you would have to do is work one day on the walking routes as a PTF (Former designation for Part Time Flex) carrier and you would change to a more informed view. The other reason it’s unique is because of the number of cul-de-sac’s between Tn. ave. and Outer Drive. All walking routes.These would be better served with a cluster box in each one and the parking would not be affected at all. Please don’t take my word for it Ellen . Find out for yourself and the truth will become evident within one hour of your feet on the ground in an actual mail delivery scenario.
Harold L. Parkey says
All the city manager has to do is to challenge the postal managers decision by using the language in POM 631.6. It should take the wind out of the postal managers sails. You are correct, it will cause a lot of problems with parking but even if the box is blocked and the car blocking it is not under the customers control the carrier should get out of their vehicle and deliver the mail (see POM sec. 623.21 and 632.14).
David A. Vudragovich says
Why not remove the postal carrier all together?
Get a P.O. Box.
Better still support my fellow local business owner at The UPS Store, next to Fire House Subs, they have some pretty competitive pricing, support a local business and know your mail is safely stored, they received boxes (so it does not sit out in the weather), etc.
I have had a P.O. Box since 1996 ish.
The only problem is I still get junk mail, aka paper spam!
J Martin says
The TN DMV will tell you that your driver’s license has to have your actual residential address on it, not a PO Box and not a rented box like you would get at UPS or The Mail Center, Etc. That has been my experience. Any renewal forms from the DMV are mailed to your residence.
I’d like to add that the Mail Center, Etc. is also a good place
to rent a mailbox. They will take UPS & FedEx packages that can’t be delivered to a PO Box, plus it eliminates having a package sitting on your front door step when no one is home. And if you go on vacation you don’t have to stop your mail. The only slight drawback is that you have to go during business hours to retrieve any packages that are too big to fit into your box. I have used them for over 20 years and highly recommend them.
David A. Vudragovich says
Yes, your driver’s license has to have a physical address in the first line, but in the second line it can have a PO Box, mine does. (disclaimer: just make sure your physical and PO Box are in the same city/zip)
And with both address lines completed and not having a physical mail box, it does get forwarded to the second line in your address (I get my license renewals, property tax updates and car sticker bills at my PO Box)
My wife and I had live in our home 22 days and someone came by and baseball batted our mail box over, I pulled up the post and I have not received any mail at my house since June 23, 2010.
I know of the Mail Center, but do not know the owner or anyone there.
I know Bryan with the UPS Store to be active with some of the Non Profits I am involved with and you do have after hour access to your PO Box, but the packages have to be picked up …before 7?
J Martin says
Thanks for the info about putting a PO box on the second line — didn’t know one could do that. I know all about having mailboxes destroyed… in 20 years I think I’m on my 5th or 6th mailbox. smh
David A. Vudragovich says
It comes from lots of specific question asking and sometimes asking the same question three different ways and getting three different answers. Then you point it out to the person and they go “oh, you are right”
I was wrongly sued years ago and ended up w some property damage from my address on the legal documents so I am not a fan of giving out my property addresses.
And no mail box out front is one less thing to mow around!
Denny Phillips says
Ha! I haven’t seen an issue this critical since citizens were asked to pull their trash cans to the curb 15 or so years ago.
johnhuotari says
I posted a new story here: http://oakridgetoday.com/2013/06/12/u-s-postal-service-can-ask-for-mailbox-move-but-cant-require-it-spokesman-says/
The U.S. Postal Service cannot require anyone to move his or her mailbox. They can also ask or encourage.